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Is Yahoo! BrowserPlus spyware?

So, how is BrowserPlus not just spyware for Yahoo!? In the privacy policy in the version I was about to install (2.1.7) it claims that it may collect a "unique identifier, your browsing activity or the web sites you visit" so long as it doesn't tie it to personally identifiable information.

Definition:
"Spyware is any piece of software, installed or employed without a user’s knowledge, that watches, logs, and reports on that user’s electronic movements."

So, in essence, BrowserPlus is effectively spyware for any user who installs it and doesn't read AND comprehend the entire license agreement and privacy policy statements (which users typically click through without reading anyway).

This spyware-like activity could have been mitigated if the application made it apparent to end users on a per-interaction basis that they are transmitting the entirety of their electronic movements to Yahoo!.

From the privacy policy:

BrowserPlus may gather, store and transmit to Yahoo! the following anonymous information about your usage of the BrowserPlus for diagnostic and software improvement purposes:
o Your device’s platform (i.e., osx, win 32, XP).
o The version number of BrowserPlus that you have installed.
o A unique identifier assigned to your installation of BrowserPlus. Yahoo! will NOT associate this unique identifier, your browsing activity or the web sites you visit to you or any of your personally identifiable information.

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  • QUOTE (i_like_tomatoes @ Nov 12 2008, 07:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    So, in essence, BrowserPlus is effectively spyware for any user who installs it and doesn't read AND comprehend the entire license agreement and privacy policy statements (which users typically click through without reading anyway).

    This spyware-like activity could have been mitigated if the application made it apparent to end users on a per-interaction basis that they are transmitting the entirety of their electronic movements to Yahoo!.


    Hi Tomatoes,

    Here's exactly what we do:
    1. The first time BrowserPlus runs it creates a unique string (UUID)
    2. Every time you visit a site that uses BrowserPlus, at the end of the session, when you shut down the page, we perform a HTTP get request that includes:
    a. the unique string
    b. the platform you run (windows or mac)
    c. the browser you were using

    We have no way of tying the UUID to an identity, all we know from this information is that someone is using browserplus. The utility of the UUID is to allow us to see how many different people are using browserplus, distinguishing uses from users. This information gives us a meaningful way to gauge the adoption and success of the platform, and more importantly, allows us to appropriately scale our server infrastructure to ensure that the system continues to run smoothly.

    We don't know who you are, we don't know what sites you're visiting. We don't even have a mechanism to understand which sites use BrowserPlus without them telling us. All of these are in the name of user privacy... To this point the BrowserPlus project is audited by three distinct groups inside yahoo that exist to ensure your privacy and safety.

    If you feel the language in the EULA could be modified to make exactly what we do more clear, please suggest something and I'll work with our legal team to get it fixed. If you feel that the information we capture is out of line, please raise that point too.

    Finally, I hope you see that "transmitting the entirety of their electronic movements to Yahoo!" is a gross overstatement of what we do.

    best,
    lloyd
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  • Hi Lloyd,

    Thank you for the quick response and the clarification! Yahoo! has always had a fairly good reputation for guarding privacy so let's see if we can improve the wording of the privacy statement to reflect that. With license reviews it's not necessarily a question of what is being done now, but what could some dark, evil, contract-following overlord (or secret governmental agency) could do after he/she/it purchases this product and all the existing licenses.

    My first concern is with using the data for "diagnostic and software improvement purposes." This does not limit the data to just improving BrowserPlus. You could also interpret this to mean improving the software you use when determining what ads to place on pages that I visit or diagnosing why users that visit your competitors first don't buy your products as frequently. So I would suggest limiting this clause to just diagnosing and improving the BrowserPlus software.

    The big clause that gives me heart palpitations is the "o A unique identifier assigned to your installation of BrowserPlus. Yahoo! will NOT associate: (this unique identifier, your browsing activity or the web sites you visit) to (you or any of your personally identifiable information)." Geek markup added for emphasis.

    After your explanation, it seems like that last point should just be truncated to "o A unique identifier assigned to your installation of BrowserPlus." Adding references to your browsing activity and sites visited in-line with the list of data that you are collecting is confounding. As a new paragraph, then you should point out that the data BrowserPlus is collecting never gets mixed with any other data Yahoo may have on you. Perhaps something like "Yahoo! will NOT associate any of these above data with any other data Yahoo! and/or third parties may already be collecting about you." That line sounds rather big-brother-esk and may require some smoothing, but I think the important point is to take the reference to browsing activity and sites visited out of the list of data collected.

    Also based on your response, it sounds like you should add an element to the collected data list for "The date and time you access web pages that utilize BrowserPlus functionality." As a lay person, an analogy may be the difference between "giving me the key to the bathroom" vs. "automatically tracking the exact time you enter the bathroom and how long you were there."

    On a separate note, to keep up with the state of your competition, you should also include an opt-out feature that would not send that data to Yahoo!. I believe the norm is moving towards making these data collections an option that can be turned on or off AND that option is off until the user verifies that it can be turned on.

    The product looks interesting. If these agreement documents can be smoothed to the point where they are acceptable to my user population, I would love to give this technology a try on some of our business apps. Thank you for listening to my concerns over this.

    Best regards,
    Tomatoes
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  • QUOTE (i_like_tomatoes @ Nov 12 2008, 07:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    So, how is BrowserPlus not just spyware for Yahoo!? In the privacy policy in the version I was about to install (2.1.7) it claims that it may collect a "unique identifier, your browsing activity or the web sites you visit" so long as it doesn't tie it to personally identifiable information.

    Definition:
    "Spyware is any piece of software, installed or employed without a user’s knowledge, that watches, logs, and reports on that user’s electronic movements."


    Tomatoes,

    I'm going to get really nitpicky here but it may be warranted just for the sake of clarification. Technically, the definition of Spyware that you quote would not actually be valid in the case of arguing that BrowserPlus is Spyware because, as it states, it is software that is "installed or employed without a user's knowledge". In the case of BrowserPlus, it is obviously a user fully aware he or she is installing this piece of software and, furthermore, Yahoo! fully identifies openly through the Privacy Policy that it does:

    QUOTE
    gather, store and transmit to Yahoo! the following anonymous information about your usage of the BrowserPlus


    so, essentially, BrowserPlus would not be Spyware. The only way it could be argued as Spyware is if Yahoo! somehow secretly tried to install the code without the end user knowing about the installation. But they don't and they fully tell you in the Privacy Policy that they are getting information from you.

    In my opinion, the language is fine. But, of course, I'm merely looking at it straight from a technical perspective which doesn't necessarily mean that the wording is fine in regards to Public Relations, customer service, good will, etc. So, I guess it's sort of a difference between the lawyer and the PR person debating over which is the best road to travel here.

    Mike H.



    ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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    Personal Portfolio Site: http://www.michaelwhall.info
    Includes photography, websites, digital art and music samples.
    "Downtown" CD now available for download & purchase. (http://www.michaelwhall.info/music/music.php)
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  • I have a concern with the BrowserPlus program. I have never knowingly downloaded BrowserPlus yet it has appeared on my system twice (and been summarily uninstalled). I do use the Yahoo Toolbar, but no other Yahoo programs, as I access my Yahoo Mail within Firefox. If it appears on my system without me choosing or allowing it to download, wouldn't that make it spyware?
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  • QUOTE (Katie @ Dec 2 2009, 11:37 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    I have a concern with the BrowserPlus program. I have never knowingly downloaded BrowserPlus yet it has appeared on my system twice (and been summarily uninstalled). I do use the Yahoo Toolbar, but no other Yahoo programs, as I access my Yahoo Mail within Firefox. If it appears on my system without me choosing or allowing it to download, wouldn't that make it spyware?



    I have a concern with the EULA as well. I believe that browser plus is installed when you try to send an attachment in Yahoo Mail. The attach button doesn't seem to work for me and I had to click the link at the bottom which says something about "attach files easier". That is another way of saying "install Browser plus by clicking here". I wish I had known that was what I was installing. I also think its silly to have to install something just to attach files. I have been using Yahoo for 12 years and it was the home of my first email. Having to install something such as this, seriously makes me reconsider who I use for my email needs. Privacy, as I said is also a concern. Perhaps it is private, but the language certainly keeps it open ended. Usually companies say something like "we only use this for improving the product" and "we will collect no private information". Reputable companies also give you an opt out, option from such collection methods.

    I hope yahoo is willing to make these changes or myself and may of my friends will be looking elsewhere for their online communication needs.
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  • QUOTE (James @ Jan 15 2010, 07:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    I have a concern with the EULA as well. I believe that browser plus is installed when you try to send an attachment in Yahoo Mail. The attach button doesn't seem to work for me and I had to click the link at the bottom which says something about "attach files easier". That is another way of saying "install Browser plus by clicking here". I wish I had known that was what I was installing. I also think its silly to have to install something just to attach files. I have been using Yahoo for 12 years and it was the home of my first email. Having to install something such as this, seriously makes me reconsider who I use for my email needs. Privacy, as I said is also a concern. Perhaps it is private, but the language certainly keeps it open ended. Usually companies say something like "we only use this for improving the product" and "we will collect no private information". Reputable companies also give you an opt out, option from such collection methods.

    I hope yahoo is willing to make these changes or myself and may of my friends will be looking elsewhere for their online communication needs.

    browser plus was installed on my system without my approval also, it was there for a month before i just happened across it in my programs... i may just drop yahoo altogether. don't like stuff that is awful close to spyware being installed on my pc without my consent period!
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  • QUOTE (KEN @ Feb 9 2010, 01:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    browser plus was installed on my system without my approval also, it was there for a month before i just happened across it in my programs... i may just drop yahoo altogether. don't like stuff that is awful close to spyware being installed on my pc without my consent period!


    I have just found it on my system too. I updated my Java yesterday morning in accordance with the reminder prompt but opting out of the yahoo tool bar as it takes up too much space on my memory and I use firefox so dont even need it anyway but then I had heaps of trouble even getting onto any site as my browser couldnt find any server at all, including yahoo and it took me many hours and well into the small hours of this morning before i got any life back into my browser. Then, on switching on today I discovered the Browser Plus had been installed. Yahoo has always been my first choice of communication system, and is my very first email address but after reading all this and the troubles I had to sort out all night long with my computer I am also considering abandoning it, why would anyone volunteer to be spyed on?

    If I uninstall the Browser Plus program will that now affect my connections yet again?
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  • I just found it on my computer, too. I did NOT knowingly install it, and that just plain pisses me off!
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    • G
    • Feb 26, 2010
    Outrage!

    BrowserPlus drive-by download infected my PC this week. No installs, eula, privacy or other agreement sought or granted.

    Funny how this happens after Yahoo! climbs into bed with M$.

    Final straw - one less customer. Shame all round.
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  • Was about to shut down my pc when it highlighted new software was installed. I googled it and found this forum. Then I uninstalled it. Thanks all for explaining what BrowserPlus is all about.
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  • QUOTE (Honey @ Feb 26 2010, 12:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    Was about to shut down my pc when it highlighted new software was installed. I googled it and found this forum. Then I uninstalled it. Thanks all for explaining what BrowserPlus is all about.


    Wow, more people out of nowhere from the beginning of this year til now have had this unknowingly installed on their systems. Mine was an odd occurrence, however. I was simply restarting my computer to clear the caches and everything, because I normally leave it on. Upon restarting(soft restart), the computer shut down completely. I had to push the power button, as if I had clicked "Shutdown". When it turned on, I got this wierd startup screen saying "ASUS Express somthing". Not normal, but I know enough about computers that I continued to see what happened. I saw a screen with some sort of 'quick access' options, though Windows 7 was not running. It was a screen that I have never seen before. I pressed the escape button, then got brought to the "Your session was saved to disk" blah blah.... Now, I remind you, that I had restarted my computer, so there should not have been any session saved.

    This is where BROWSERPLUS comes into play. I deleted the restoration data, and started the computer as normal. BUT, now I have BrowserPlus installed on my system. It even showed up highlighted on my start, showing that it was recently installed!

    WHAT THE HECK YAHOO?!
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  • I have also just had a drive-by installation of browser plus. It is now being uninstalled. Unacceptable.
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  • Hey Folks,

    I'm Lloyd Hilaiel, and I work at Yahoo! on the BrowserPlus team. I don't expect I'll sway many opinions here, but its worth a shot.

    Our goal in using BrowserPlus inside Yahoo! Mail is to provide the best and easiest attachment experience on the planet. One part of that is doing better than is possible in todays browsers. In order to accomplish this we wrote custom software that integrates with your web browser and makes things like in-page photo touchup and better photo selection possible. We're also experimenting with ways to make uploads go much faster.

    Part of this problem is to make it easy for people to install the supporting software. Here's where we walk a tightrope. We've found that if the installation experience is too hard, it's frustrating for users and makes Y! Mail *harder* to use, so we went about making the installation seemless and simple. The flip side of that is that it's possible to not realize you've installed software. Where's the correct balance here?

    We decided that the installation experience should be clear, direct, and seemless, and that to make sure people in the community feel comfortable with the software we:
    1. have made the platform open source so anyone can ready the code that comprises it. This makes exactly what BrowserPlus does 100% transparent. Code available here: http://github.com/browserplus/platform
    2. have spent man months making the uninstallation fast and complete (it's litterally one click to uninstall, we don't ask why you want to uninstall, we don't delay, we just do our best to blow browserplus off your machine).
    3. have publicly accessible forums (like this one), chat rooms, and bug tracking. all of that is hosted here: http://browserplus.org
    4. have a rule that when browserplus is not in use it Does Not Run. That means zero impact to the performance of your machine when you're not actively benefiting from it.
    5. We put prominent links to uninstallation in your start menu (or system preferences pane). If users have problems uninstalling we personally respond to their emails and forum posts to help them get rid of BrowserPlus.
    6. We have a team of security professionals and a team privacy advocates who oversee what we do, who must approve each feature we add.

    I too get bummed out when I end up feeling like software that I wasn't told about and don't want lands on my computer. I wouldn't work at a company nor on a product that I didn't truly believe was *good*. The reason I've spent years of my life working at Yahoo! on BrowserPlus is because I believe it's a meaningful product that can make websites work better, and I daresay empower more professionals and hobbyists to impact the core technologies of the web.

    So please give the features that BrowserPlus provides another look: http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/mail/yaho...context-21.html

    If you still feel there's anything deceptive or bad about the installation experience, I challenge you to offer constructive and viable feedback about how we might better walk the tightrope of disclosure vs. convenience.

    sincerely,
    lloyd
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  • QUOTE (Lloyd Hilaiel @ Apr 1 2010, 04:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    Hey Folks,

    I'm Lloyd Hilaiel, and I work at Yahoo! on the BrowserPlus team. I don't expect I'll sway many opinions here, but its worth a shot.

    Our goal in using BrowserPlus inside Yahoo! Mail is to provide the best and easiest attachment experience on the planet. One part of that is doing better than is possible in todays browsers. In order to accomplish this we wrote custom software that integrates with your web browser and makes things like in-page photo touchup and better photo selection possible. We're also experimenting with ways to make uploads go much faster.

    Part of this problem is to make it easy for people to install the supporting software. Here's where we walk a tightrope. We've found that if the installation experience is too hard, it's frustrating for users and makes Y! Mail *harder* to use, so we went about making the installation seemless and simple. The flip side of that is that it's possible to not realize you've installed software. Where's the correct balance here?

    We decided that the installation experience should be clear, direct, and seemless, and that to make sure people in the community feel comfortable with the software we:
    1. have made the platform open source so anyone can ready the code that comprises it. This makes exactly what BrowserPlus does 100% transparent. Code available here: http://github.com/browserplus/platform
    2. have spent man months making the uninstallation fast and complete (it's litterally one click to uninstall, we don't ask why you want to uninstall, we don't delay, we just do our best to blow browserplus off your machine).
    3. have publicly accessible forums (like this one), chat rooms, and bug tracking. all of that is hosted here: http://browserplus.org
    4. have a rule that when browserplus is not in use it Does Not Run. That means zero impact to the performance of your machine when you're not actively benefiting from it.
    5. We put prominent links to uninstallation in your start menu (or system preferences pane). If users have problems uninstalling we personally respond to their emails and forum posts to help them get rid of BrowserPlus.
    6. We have a team of security professionals and a team privacy advocates who oversee what we do, who must approve each feature we add.

    I too get bummed out when I end up feeling like software that I wasn't told about and don't want lands on my computer. I wouldn't work at a company nor on a product that I didn't truly believe was *good*. The reason I've spent years of my life working at Yahoo! on BrowserPlus is because I believe it's a meaningful product that can make websites work better, and I daresay empower more professionals and hobbyists to impact the core technologies of the web.

    So please give the features that BrowserPlus provides another look: http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/mail/yaho...context-21.html

    If you still feel there's anything deceptive or bad about the installation experience, I challenge you to offer constructive and viable feedback about how we might better walk the tightrope of disclosure vs. convenience.

    sincerely,
    lloyd
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  • I'm just an over the shoulder watcher of this transaction. a "guy off the street", so to speak.

    My problem is that I can't install the program, can't follow the instructions for reporting the problem, and....finally....can't use the attachment feature on my emails.

    Aside from the mess you've gotten me into, that i can't seem to get out of, this looks like a great product.....

    ....other than the fact that it's tied up in some legal department discussion of just what yahoo want;s from me, as in a counter as to how many people are using their product, etc. and on and on.

    What I do know is that it doesn't work, I can't get it loaded (it's time out feature is a classic after about 45 seconds) and I now am reduced to wondering just how you're so concerned about spyware legalize when the stupid product doesn't download. and I can't use my my attachment feature?

    How about a place I can go to with a real person that i can really speak to to solve my problem? Please run that by the legal team on the way to the customer care department which is down the hall from the corner windowed office of the VP AND GET ME SOME FRIGGIN HELP
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  • QUOTE (Brent @ Apr 3 2010, 04:59 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    I'm just an over the shoulder watcher of this transaction. a "guy off the street", so to speak.

    My problem is that I can't install the program, can't follow the instructions for reporting the problem, and....finally....can't use the attachment feature on my emails.

    Aside from the mess you've gotten me into, that i can't seem to get out of, this looks like a great product.....

    ....other than the fact that it's tied up in some legal department discussion of just what yahoo want;s from me, as in a counter as to how many people are using their product, etc. and on and on.

    What I do know is that it doesn't work, I can't get it loaded (it's time out feature is a classic after about 45 seconds) and I now am reduced to wondering just how you're so concerned about spyware legalize when the stupid product doesn't download. and I can't use my my attachment feature?

    How about a place I can go to with a real person that i can really speak to to solve my problem? Please run that by the legal team on the way to the customer care department which is down the hall from the corner windowed office of the VP AND GET ME SOME FRIGGIN HELP


    Yo Brent,

    This place is where you can talk to real people. If you want to chat with us in real time, we have an IRC chat room that we hang out in all the time. All conversations there are archived. http://browserplus.org/discuss/

    If you've never used IRC before, here's a quick tutorial: http://irchelp.org/irchelp/irctutorial.html

    As far as installing the program, you can try an all-in-one installer located here:
    http://github.com/downloads/browserplus/pl..._2.7.0_full.exe
    or this one if you're on a mac:
    http://github.com/downloads/browserplus/pl..._2.7.0_full.dmg

    Finally, if you want to share the details of your system (OS version, and what browser you're using) here, then we can go from there and I can do my best to support you through this forum.

    eager to help,
    lloyd
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  • QUOTE (Lloyd Hilaiel @ Apr 5 2010, 08:38 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    Yo Brent,

    This place is where you can talk to real people. If you want to chat with us in real time, we have an IRC chat room that we hang out in all the time. All conversations there are archived. http://browserplus.org/discuss/

    If you've never used IRC before, here's a quick tutorial: http://irchelp.org/irchelp/irctutorial.html

    As far as installing the program, you can try an all-in-one installer located here:
    http://github.com/downloads/browserplus/pl..._2.7.0_full.exe
    or this one if you're on a mac:
    http://github.com/downloads/browserplus/pl..._2.7.0_full.dmg

    Finally, if you want to share the details of your system (OS version, and what browser you're using) here, then we can go from there and I can do my best to support you through this forum.

    eager to help,
    lloyd


    Let's start here: Win Vista Home Premium, S.P #2 with Internet Xxplorer.

    I installed the Browser Plus 2.7.0

    I can't att. files because the download won't download.
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  • Perhaps I am missing something here. I applaud the intent but think you have messed up the approach - significantly.

    I agreed to a new capability - to an existing program - and a new program appeared on my system....not a feature upgrade to an existing program.

    You didn't explain this - and the program itself provides little to no information - just a configuration, which is itself rather ominous ("allows authorized websites to manipulate images on your computer").

    Given that we live in a time of Trojan horses and viruses. - an unauthorized install is a reason for concern.

    I think you may well be offering a good an useful program - but shot yourself in the foot on the way to implementation
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  • QUOTE (George @ Apr 26 2010, 02:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    Given that we live in a time of Trojan horses and viruses. - an unauthorized install is a reason for concern.

    I think you may well be offering a good an useful program - but shot yourself in the foot on the way to implementation


    YES!

    Part of this problem is to make it easy for people to install the supporting software. Here's where we walk a tightrope. We've found that if the installation experience is too hard, it's frustrating for users and makes Y! Mail *harder* to use, so we went about making the installation seemless and simple. The flip side of that is that it's possible to not realize you've installed software. Where's the correct balance here?

    Hmmm....how about a link that says "install a program that makes it easier to send attachments..." instead of just "make it easier to send attachments". In no way shape or form should something that says THAT install a program on my computer. If I click on something to install a program on my computer I should know BEFORE I CLICK ON IT that that is what I am doing. You going behind people's backs and installing things without users realizing it is really really crappy. Not all people are stupid. Please make it clear what you are doing. I don't like giving unauthorized access to my computer to random programs and I don't think anyone else does either.
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  • You guys at Yahoo can't restart our browser without telling us! I'm using Chrome and had pages open that needed to stay open. How can you idiots not clearly tell us that you're going to refresh all the pages? No software has ever done that.
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  • attach files more easily??? Was it hard before??? never had any trouble with it why fix something that is not broke???
    How do I not attach files with out agreeing to those terms they seem a little much just to attach some files?
    Normally there is a another link that will let you skip this kind of thing!?! Do I have to go open a new email address at another site?
    To bad been with yahoo a long time!
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  • QUOTE (Lloyd Hilaiel @ Apr 1 2010, 04:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    Hey Folks,

    I'm Lloyd Hilaiel, and I work at Yahoo! on the BrowserPlus team. I don't expect I'll sway many opinions here, but its worth a shot.

    Our goal in using BrowserPlus inside Yahoo! Mail is to provide the best and easiest attachment experience on the planet. One part of that is doing better than is possible in todays browsers. In order to accomplish this we wrote custom software that integrates with your web browser and makes things like in-page photo touchup and better photo selection possible. We're also experimenting with ways to make uploads go much faster.

    Part of this problem is to make it easy for people to install the supporting software. Here's where we walk a tightrope. We've found that if the installation experience is too hard, it's frustrating for users and makes Y! Mail *harder* to use, so we went about making the installation seemless and simple. The flip side of that is that it's possible to not realize you've installed software. Where's the correct balance here?

    We decided that the installation experience should be clear, direct, and seemless, and that to make sure people in the community feel comfortable with the software we:
    1. have made the platform open source so anyone can ready the code that comprises it. This makes exactly what BrowserPlus does 100% transparent. Code available here: http://github.com/browserplus/platform
    2. have spent man months making the uninstallation fast and complete (it's litterally one click to uninstall, we don't ask why you want to uninstall, we don't delay, we just do our best to blow browserplus off your machine).
    3. have publicly accessible forums (like this one), chat rooms, and bug tracking. all of that is hosted here: http://browserplus.org
    4. have a rule that when browserplus is not in use it Does Not Run. That means zero impact to the performance of your machine when you're not actively benefiting from it.
    5. We put prominent links to uninstallation in your start menu (or system preferences pane). If users have problems uninstalling we personally respond to their emails and forum posts to help them get rid of BrowserPlus.
    6. We have a team of security professionals and a team privacy advocates who oversee what we do, who must approve each feature we add.

    I too get bummed out when I end up feeling like software that I wasn't told about and don't want lands on my computer. I wouldn't work at a company nor on a product that I didn't truly believe was *good*. The reason I've spent years of my life working at Yahoo! on BrowserPlus is because I believe it's a meaningful product that can make websites work better, and I daresay empower more professionals and hobbyists to impact the core technologies of the web.

    So please give the features that BrowserPlus provides another look: http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/mail/yaho...context-21.html

    If you still feel there's anything deceptive or bad about the installation experience, I challenge you to offer constructive and viable feedback about how we might better walk the tightrope of disclosure vs. convenience.

    sincerely,
    lloyd


    Let me make this real simple and clear for you, Lloyd and I'll say it bluntly, since everyone is worried about being polite. Me, I don't care, because I don't care about losing Yahoo, nor about this forum, nor bout hurting anyone's feelings when they're doing something dishonestly that affects me and frankly, all being nice to you has resulted in, was you responding with more of the b*llsh*t that you keep shoveling at the users here, figuring they're too stupid to figure that out. Insulting! (:

    The key thing you said is; "We decided.". Has it occurred to you that you have no right to decide for the people who paid for the computer what will be on it?

    Why is it that you don't get a simple thing like we don't want Yahoo making our decisions for us?

    And why is it that you are so dishonest about this?! It wasn't about you "making it easier for the user to install". It was about you installing it without telling anybody, because you wanted it to be on our systems and you figured once we used it, we'd like it and so no foul. But I'm here to tell you that there was a foul! That was dishonest!

    Here's the bottom line:

    Attaching files was not hard as it was! It didn't need fixing! Leave us alone, damn it!!!

    I don' like your add on. Yet it keeps installing itself, WITHOUT ASKING ME, LLOYD!!!!!!! And it doesn't even tell me that it happened! I am assuming that every time I go to Yahoo mail, it reinstalls itself.

    It screws up the Yahoo web site (search home page) for me! When it is installed and I go to Yahoo and perform a search (I use Firefox), it displays the links that result from the search query just fine. However, every single link that click on, takes me to a "404 Not Found" page! When I go to Google and go to the same link from there, it works fine and takes me to a valid web page!

    When I uninstall "Yahoo! BrowserPlus" and perform the same search again in Yahoo and click on the same link, it works fine! So yes Lloyd, it is the "Yahoo! BrowserPlus" add on that is causing the problem!!!

    Now my question is, not just how to uninstall it (I can do that), but how do I block it from ever being installed on my system again?! You people don't offer that information and install it without even telling us it's there! And yet, you want us to think you're being honest about this?! Bull!!! (:

    The truth is, that when people talk to you, they're talking to a brick wall! Nothing is going to happen, no matter what the users say and that is obvious by your responses that ignore what the user is actually saying and in which you use double talk to talk AROUND what they're saying and mke it sound like you did them a favor by lying to them and screwing them up! You're just going to be all polite like, to pacify them, but you will never actually change anything for them and we both know it!

    What is wrong in your head, that you cannot understand that the people who paid for the computer do not want you making their decisions for them?!

    And don't bother telling us how M$ puts stuff in Windows. We know that and don't like that either! And pointing your finger at someone else's guilt does not eliminate yours! It only shows that you're trying to dodge the issue!

    And no, it wasn't even as good as users here said. Yes, it did say to click to make the attaching experience better, but that isn't all that it was! In reality, it stopped allowing me to attach files at all if I didn't say okay and that is simply you forcing me to install something and not telling me that it would change a lot of things besides file attaching in Yahoo and not telling me that it would also keep installing itself again without telling me!

    Now if you want to prove me wrong and prove that I'm just some a**h*ole with a bad temper; a raving lunatic, then go ahead and let people know exactly what's happening and give them A CHOICE whether or not they want to install this thing (why you think that shouldn't be the default shows us your real attitude toward users) and give people a way to not only uninstall it, but to choose NOT to EVER have it on there again if they don't want it, instead of it automatically installing again without telling them every time they visit the Yahoo email page or something!

    How would you feel, if your car kept changing the way it ran, because the manufacturer made you install something without telling you what it was and every time you change it back, it changes to it again on you, every time you drive down you home street?!

    If this happens JUST ONE MORE TIME, I am done with Yahoo email! And like the others said, it was my first email address too. But you are so stuck on forcing your software down our throats, that you don't even care that you're losing one customer after another! You probably think that they will have to use it again, but trust me, they won't! You are not the only email option in town!

    I think the new Yahoo look and feel flat out sucks! Even maneuvering through messages and finding controls is harder now and some don't even exist any more! I couldn't even find a way to take myself out of going into the spam folder when I sent myself an email from another address!

    I DON'T WANT IT!!! Now how do I get rid of it FOREVER?!?
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  • I did not knowingly/intentionally download browser plus on to my computer.

    What I mean by that is when I obtain/purchase a piece of software I research it, identify which of my needs it meets, make a determination if the value of the software justifies the price.....then I specifically go to the website where the software is offered or sold. When there I download the software and install it on my computer. Upon installing it I am in direct possession of material which describes what the software is, how to use it and additional information. I also know exactly where it is on my computer, know how to uninstall it and so on.

    However, none of this was true with this piece of software. I just noticed it on my computer. Possibly it 'hijacked a ride' and was on a piece of software I downloaded and was clearly explained in fine print. Possibly I filled out a survey? I am not sure what I did or how I got it. I know prior to 'having' it I had no personal desire/interest to own this software. Hell, I had no clue what it was - I did not know it existed.

    Yet like a trojan, spyware, virus, maleware or worm POOF there it is on my computer despite the fact I did not plan to obtain/own it before I realized it was on my cpu.
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  • Congratulations for falling to the level of an amateur spy-ware software company Yahoo!
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  • HI, just about 10 days ago(6/15?) my yahoo calendar reminders stopped sending out emails. I have used them fine for many many years.
    Is there a way for me to report this or get a fix? I upgraded to 'safer IE9' from line on top of yahoo but no help. even tried to create new calendars to see if a new one would work--can I delete the calendars I have now and try to start over? can not find any way to submit question, came across this blog so thought someone would offer advice. dying here as I was so dependent on those email reminders!
    I am now on vista, IE9, have been for a few years so do not think any thing has changed that would cause this? thanks for any help! Jeff
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  • dasmith2011@att.net to dasmith201211@att.net I'm trying to get my email back,HELP
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  • A few days ago I shut my computer off and all was well. I turned it on the next day and the anti-virus program was not working, my camera software did not work. I went to the controls and found this Browser Plus.
    It is my computer and I do not want anyone deciding that something they worked on is great and something I should have and installing it on MY pc.
    The old Yahoo mail was much better than this current mess. I liked the emoticoms stretched out and not crammed in a square box. I liked the set up of the mail the way it was. I liked the ease of attaching files and now its a hassle.
    I do not want Browser Plus on my PC ever again and if it means I have to transfer to another email provider then that is what I will do. Your intent "may" have been okay but its not welcome in the least.
    chinook

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  • If I have read the explanation for browserplus correctly, and it is possible that I have not, what does making upload speed improvements have to do with recording website visits? I do not see the connection. Also, why is it that I cannot choose not to install this program and do a classic slow upload? It is my time after all, not yours.

    It may be true that Yahoo, using its current protocols, will not be able to identify me personally with my web traffic it is recording. However, anyone able to get my UUID will be able to do so. With open source code that might be accomplished without your knowledge, and is likely to be done so. But regardless there will be ways to link my browsing with me, quite simply the UUID.

    I know that regardless of your intentions, we all know about the paving of roads and such, Yahoo did not give me a choice when I need to send an attachment. You held me hostage with your tracking software in exchange for my file attachment. That is more than modestly deceptive, it is what I call coersion.

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  • It did ask me to click to make the attaching experience better, I didnt realize it was going to add more than that. Now I cannot delete any emails, they reappear after a minute or two. and I cannot access my folders on the left side of my yahoo mail. So all of my saved emails are essentially gone, if I cant open them. What Happened Yahoo? Is there a customer support phone number for yahoo mail?

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